Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by Alexander852, Dec 22, 2012.
i cant do anything and i even have the permission '*' i only can build when i am op
Don't use PEX. Problem solved.
but its the best...
You're new here, aren't you?
I guess? what do you recommend?
Peoples for PermissionsEx or that use permissionsex there is a dev build for permissionsex i use it so no glitches so far. If your afraid to download because of permissions people opping themselves don't worry. none at all.
What then? All the biggest servers use ranks?
A combination of Privileges, ChatSuite and RankSuite. Each plugin focusing on its core responsibilities instead of a permission plugin trying to do everything.
Ill consider, I really would rather a permissions thing doing everything, and it's "doing everything" doesn't take away from the fact that it is the most widely used, and reliable permissions plugin which is why I find it bothersome that this update screwed that up.
Widely used, perhaps. Best? Hardly. It has bugs in it which make it fail using Bukkit methods - aka, it actually breaks Bukkit.
Priviledges didn't break on the update, and its the fastest permission plugin.
It's most widely used, yes. But it is least reliable. The crash reports, the plugin breakages, the un-fixed bugs sitting for months all contribute to the conclusion that pex is the worst permissions plugin choice.
pex works fine for me just use the pex dev. build
you both are talking something I have NEVER once experienced with PEX and that's the only one I have used since I've used bukkit, giving the once and a while break between builds PEX has NEVER bugged out or FAILED in anyways shape or form the only FAIL that PEX has is trust humans to know how to USE IT. anyone with a brain knows to drop PEX in to SQL and use REGEX and you will blow the snot outta and other permission system. Wide mass updates anywhere from the known internet reaches with simple point and click updates via websites... no other permission system I know of offers the ability for that other then PEX... maybe because it branch's out and use's something other than Yet Another crappy Markup Language that cannot tell how to use a tab.
You guys may not support going outside the box but don't bash good plugins because they do
but other than that You guys do great work and provide very good releases and timing is great I'm one of your patient but willing to try bleeding edge supporters! but again please don't bash something just because they offer abilities that give the average user to run a FULL BLOWN proper server, Granted the "average" user probably couldn't figure out how to set up MySQL and Apache let alone get them to run together in sync... but for the ones that do... they have now achieved stability, prevention of there permissions being reset EVER if bad update or any kind causes config wipes all the owner has to do is re-enter there SQL DB info and away they go
Let me make an ass out of you and me for a second while I assume your referring to the server owners that do things like Permission.Node.* and everyone that joins there server is instantly op'd deopd and kicked every time they join. that's a simple case of being human and not RTFM.
I am sure they have been a few bugs here and there But like I said I've never seen one except for the odd break between bukkit builds which yes rendered the server useless but didn't wipe my very safe guarded permission setup <3 MySQL (sqlite is great but we all have our favorites and live editing just tips the cup for me I look specifically for plugins that store all there important data inside MySQL)
because we all know manual configuration of a servers permissions for ANY perm plugin takes along time and to lose that is very frustrating
PEX does not meet the basic qualifications of a good plugin, let alone a great plugin. I appreciate that you have (anecdotally) had a good experience with the plugin, but that doesn't negate the crash reports and even worse the silent breakages that I have observed on PEX. It will deadlock the server, it will prevent certain plugins from sending messages to players. These situations can happen no matter what your configuration is and thus are not a user issue. They are a plugin issue and that plugin is PEX.
I hear what your saying, and would have some better understanding where you are coming from if I was not noticing every bit of info I needed from my plugins when i wanted it and on action of players, that's the unfortunate position we all live with when you allow there to be plugin developers and allow many many duplicate plugins flood the market because we all "need a choice" "who cares whats good I just want a choice", we run in to many plugins that are incompatible with each other but I wish I could have seen the problems you speak of maybe I would think of PEX differently but it's never failed once it does an immaculate job and stopping my players from doing what i do not want them to do... like put lava in a dispenser. (Modifyworld / PEX combination but they are the same developer so of course)
I do not like absence in updates just as much as the other guy, but you have to remember there is a thing called LIFE that we all have to attend to and we do not know what they had to endure if anything that possibly could be the cause of there absence to updates.
Some people... You probably know who I am talking about purposly quit and stop updating there plugins, them you can complain about but most honest and decent people will inform you of absence if they can.
And from my eyes PEX is still up todate right now maybe only DEV but I was not running a DEV until these new "safe guards" I was running an APPROVED BY BUKKIT plugin called PEX.
You also claim that PEX crashed servers? which plugins didn't I'm sure almost every plugin has "crashed" the server HELL Ive used the server no plugins and the server crashed the server itself... whats your point I'm still a bukkit fan even though you guys are locking yourselves down I still support you... even with your crashes and instabilities that you have brought and removed many times.
P.S. your host is garbage who's idea was it to go with curse I didn't even use curse for WoW. why would I want to for MC sadly FORCED to with bukkit (at least limited to the forums as far as I know) but curse sucks... always dropping with resolving at least in Canada I can't even to keep a steady connection to curse.
s32ialx, my server's been running PEX since its release and I think what mbaxter means is that, while the plugin works fine for the most part, there are standards that have been set that it isn't living up to. I agree it is powerful in some aspects, but it also does more than it needs to. For example, prefixes and suffixes should be handled by plugins like iChat, which can cause more problems than necessary if and when the plugin breaks.
Wasn't this thread about CraftBukkit?
It's not standards. It takes down servers, deadlocking them into 'read timed out' spam. Unless you count "not crashing servers" as a standard
The hard thing I have seeing with this statement is how is it most widely used if it deadlocks servers you would imagine that it would be least used.
Thanks But I don't see how there is a problem my prefixes and suffixes work fine with hero chat, auto rank, and with enjin website, as well as all the other plugins I used that used the prefixes. all the prefixes do (which are over writeable)
User prefix will overwrite a group prefix and are completely customizable.
sorry if this got to off topic... I just not very appreciative of bashing great plugins esp the only one that's concerned about security and protection of the "precious" permissions. regardless if you allow your admins remote to the server you can prevent them from accessing the Permission DB or any DB that's in a MySQL DB while lets see oh wait I can edit a yml file directly in notepad over the internet?
I feel like were trying to compare Linux and Windows and battle for supremacy
P.S. and with the improvements made to Video Card drivers and Steams port to Linux...
the Battle is looking more towards a Tie nowadays... Finally... I might have all the reasons to drop Windows. But I still trust it over Linux due to the exploit-abilities and how easy I've seen users gain Root access to terminals
Is there something specific that causes it to do that? I've personally never had that problem.
PermissionsEx + /reload = Lesson learnt
PermissionsBukkit for the win!
Lots of people smoke even knowing it's bad for them.
Trouble is that the deadlock doesn't come with a stacktrace. It's not going to happen every 5 minutes, the odds are low but present nonetheless. Want to reproduce? One of the plugins that it breaks with is Essentials. Not Essential's fault at all, it works perfectly fine on all the other permissions plugins. It has a small chance of deadlocking your server on PEX. Why? Because PEX has a habit of breaking things.
One of my favorite analogies for describing people's continued usage of PEX:
Running a permissions plugin is like running through a field along a path. With PEX, that field has a mine buried in it. Some people will always run the same route, one that happens to not cross the mine, and never need worry. Some start out running the path of the mine, and pretty soon their foot will hit it. Others change their path routinely, and some day will trigger the mine. Thus, some people may never have an issue with it, but why the hell would you let anybody run across a minefield when there are plenty of mine-free fields available?
In the analogy, your plugin setup is the path that you take through the minefield. It won't trigger for everyone but it's better to just avoid the minefield entirely.
The alternatives to using it are many and varied, and I'd suggest any of them over PEX. Privileges, bPermissions, PermissionsBukkit, GroupManager, etc.
that works from from me from the console and from the client... as well from the website.
(Though I have had a "/reload" choke on me in similar ways but that was with or with out pex... ) and has not been in so long.. I stopped using /reload as I never trusted bukkit with it but your probably right it could be plugin caused... PEX? I dunno maybe on some bad builds but that's life there are bad builds bad days bad streets bad drivers (automobile and hardware).
I hate essentials for more then one reason none being a crash caused by pex... but more to the way to much, I guess you could say hates a bit much but IMO it's hard enough with out a standardized permission system that has a standardized GUI in-game like with World of Warcraft Private Servers.... it was not a needed to use and didn't come by default but if you added a simple LUA add ons to your WoW add ons folder you could now do anything you wanted to the item/player/entity/building/ore/etc Databases... questing...
and it was all in game real time no reloading BS the only time you reloaded your server was when you complied a new build with new features and bug fixes and after you tested the bugs you were aiming to fix... not to mention you had to make sure your ACID was up todate and many other USER created scripts but were ESSENTIAL to have a Vanilla like WoW Experience but 100% customizable I remember building Item Malls in game way up on top of one of the peaks Thousand Needles adding new buildings and npcs selling custom items that we set up all driven by MySQL... not to mention on a 1MB upload 500+ players no lag. but that was all Pre WOTLK...
now that got way off topic but relates none the less.
but Essentials has way to much config I have more then essentials thats a boat load of configurations needed and then I gotta mess with all my other plugins.. essentials took it and make EverythingPackedIntoOne. (A few jars), but they don't have everything and not what I want. and the chances it would be added anytime soon.. LOL that's like you removing the safeguard or even making it more "bypassable" which I'm on the fence with
Well I use PermissionsEx on one of my servers because it supports auto-ranking. One time I used the /reload command and it choked the server with tons of errors and a lot of plugins just broke until the server was restarted. Since that I've never dared to use the command, but /reload is known to cause memory leaks anyway so I wouldn't suggest it.
But otherwise I prefer PermissionsBukkit because of its simplicity, it does everything a permissions plugin should do. There are also much better chat plugins than the one PermissionsEx has in-built. Finally PermissionsBukkit doesn't break in new versions of Bukkit.
mbaxter Thanks for clearing that up. Good thing I'm boss at Minesweeper.
Thanks at least I'm not the only one that agrees /reload is messed up! has been for along time...
Issue I have with all the other plugins is they do not support mysql, Becuase with the power of MySQL and REGEX I mean permission requests just fly.
Try updating to the latest development build of PEX. Also check your error log.
Same as you ;p
None of these things have ever happened to us.
Doesn't change that this is proven. "He hasn't killed me!" doesn't mean he's not a murderer.
No, it means he hasn't killed me.
Is it standard practice for Bukkit staff to "name and shame" bad developers now?
Thus you agree antidotal evidence is not useful.
No, but we won't shy away from providing good solid proven evidence why you may want to choose a better plugin.
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