Public Announcement for [Permissions]

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by Nijikokun, Aug 25, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Offline


    @Lunar Delta I hope this is the last switch and that we won't have to get forced onto yet another platform.
  2. Offline


    Well I also agree with that I mean I don't have a qualm with moving eventually I just raged coz I felt I was being forced to do so when I already know about 5 of my plugins do not even use superperms yet and the rest do but these are nice plugins I also read on some the plugins dev threads that the developers do not even know what to do yet.

    Upgrade or not upgrade there is a lot of mix messages going around about what should be used according to them.
    I don't to be forced to move if I am simply not ready to do so I wanted to carefully plan and look at the options first rushing into it will only make my head spin and make more rage about it.

    Also the issue and bug reports u saw were mostly from ppl using global permissions I had it working in 10min from GM to P3, I already read Global stuff was not working people seemed to think they had to use global config files but you did not you just add the world to the clone list and it was done it would clone user ranks and permissions.

    eventually the developer made an OP update telling everyone to NOT use the global configs instead do it how I had done it from the start.

    The other people were just angry that they had no clue how to convert 2x to 3x and it was really easy it was only a small tweak to the formatting even for GM.

    3x functioned identical to 2x not even joking except you could clone worlds and use GM's "- -node.node" stuff.
    It was not nearly as painful as this new system that now wants me to re write the entire config re adding every single node again only this time I have to go thru every plugin and grab all these new nodes that do not use * anymore and try jumble it all around and test it all over again.

    Plus I do not think I can give "- -node.node" stuff coz some permissions plugins that use superperms has a method for it I know bpermissions does using a single "^" instead of "- -" but what about PEX or these other ones PEX is by far the better one at least by reading the OP thread since it uses NO bridges and is backwards compatible with 3x plugins apparently according to you I cane even leave the nodes the same and it wont matter so that's good news.

    Anyway I hope you see my point coz I see your point and intentions are good but I think it was just poorly executed and just causes confusion.
  3. Offline


    I'm not entirely too sure you understand exactly what Bukkit's "SuperPerms" is. There's no hooks for anything. The permissions plugin a server operator uses doesn't change anything at all in the code just so long as it is a "SuperPerms" plugin.

    Perhaps you ought to read up on the API if you are in any way familiar with Java -- then perhaps you would understand the counter-arguments to yours.
  4. Offline


    Hot damn you're right! I confused it with 3.1.6. But no to conformity and yes to identity!
  5. Offline

    Nathan C

    Good thing I still have most every version on my PC.
  6. Offline


    Completely your opinion!
    As a plugin developer I removed old Permissions support out of my newest plugin version to force users to update to new permissions system.
  7. Offline


    This saddens me as it was so amazing. O well, THANK YOU for the great plugin while it lasted you did a wonderful job. I hope to see more wonderful plugins come from you!

  8. Offline


    Permissions 2/3 was a a great plugin while it was needed. I personaly never used permissions 3 because permissions 2.7 did everything i needed it to do. I am now using permissions bukkit and i find it great. Its simple once you get the hang of it. And for anyone who doesnt like the change of layout for bukkit permissions then permissionsEx is almost the exact same as old permissions. However i perfer permissions bukkit. I have never tried bpermissions though.

    No matter which of the 3 new plugins you use they all support superperms so thats a good thing for plugin developers and for server admins beucase plugin permissions will be all coded the same and not have to worry about different systems.
  9. Offline


    I feel this is Nijikokun's reaction to the events that have gone on on the forums over the last week or so.
    You are much appreciated Nijikokun and I hope you feel so.
  10. Offline


    I thank Nijikokun as well, it was a nice plugin.

    But I do have to wonder if this is a bit too rash. He could have just made a message that Permissions is no longer supported and RB #953 was the last supported RB. I think going as far as removing the .jars and such is a bit harsh. Not everyone has time to learn a new plugin right now and while they are still running the old version, might require downloading it.
  11. Offline


    I just want to say as a junior server owner with little knowledge of the innerworkings of craftbukkit, that it has been extremely difficult for me to make the migration to the new system. I know i was not using perm 3.x to its fullest extent, but this gives me a chance to start over fresh.
    At the same time i have 100s of users relying on me to keep my server running so they can enjoy playing minecraft. I took down my server for 2 hours today in an attempt to switch to permissionsbukkit which seems like the right choice for me as it looks to be the most barebones and give you the most control plugin. I had thought "well i did it the first time with perm 3.x so how hard can it be to learn a new one..."
    I failed. I realized wow! i will have to go through 20 plus plugins and define custom nodes or add nodes to groups and that doesnt even include MY nodes. The way i see it ill have to manually add ALL nodes to myself for EVERY plugin I have. I have no clue if TimeRank (awesome plugin, wish someone would pick it up) will even work correctly after i make the switch, this could break the gameplay on my server.
    Now i am fully confident in the Devs, but what im asking for is MORE DOCUMENTATION! explain fully what your plugin can do and even what SuperPerms can do. I think its very bad timing with all the Devs trying to migrate to BukkitDev.
    Hell if someone would be so kind to even mentor me while i learn any one of these new permission plugins, i would be greatly indebted. We could do it on the forums and others could benefit from it as well, or over Skype, or any way you prefer.
    I need to make this switch as it seems to be moving in the right direction. The first one to contact me whom has extensive knowledge of any of these three permissions systems and willing to tutor will receive Christmas cards from me for life.
    Final say:
    SuperPerms isn't broken but the majority of your server owners are not technically knowledgable enough to implement it correctly, unless they have an expert on staff who focuses specifically on plugins, craftbukkit and permissions. That is the main problem right now!!
    Remember its all about the users
  12. Offline


    I think I can compress all above comments:

    - Permissions saved us in times of need, it saved us well, but as all systems that grow it fundamental design has it limits, hence 2.x -> 3.x -> Superperms
    - Having again the possibility of several competing permissions plugins (only shell and interface now) the new system will also have its downsides. It will confuse the hell out of newcomers and will still provoke 'how do I do this' questions that will be answered with 3 different answers, most of them being: 'You should use X plugin, it works WAY better then Y'.

    I'm sure there is a very good reason why SuperPerms does not have .* nodes, that might get us some transition trouble, though it will simply have to become a standard plugin dev procedure to add an 'all' node.

    Personally I do hope that 1 of the current 3 major permissions shells will gain global dominance so there wont be a lot of fragmentation.

    I like the idea it will still be possible to create a completely new system that will use a revolutionary system that will change our way of thinking about permissions, some thing that is far beyond our comprehention now. And thanks to the SuperPerms 'framework' it will still work without provoking another schism.
  13. Offline


    I honestly don't understand how any of this ill-founded arguing even started. SuperPerms, as far as I can tell is a permissions standard that allows a single line of code to be used across every permission plugin (assuming it follows this standard). Yes, right now it WILL be difficult as its in sort of a transitional state between Permissions 3.x and SuperPerms and its management plugins. BUT once that is done, it should be smooth from there... My server has actually been much more stable without Permissions 3.x.
  14. Offline


    Now.... if only the conversion to PEX would work.
    When running command
    pex dump file permissions.yml
    2011-08-30 02:02:05 [INFO] [PermissionsEx] Initializing p2compat backend
    2011-08-30 02:02:05 [INFO] [PermissionsCompat] Parsing "aether.yml" file
    2011-08-30 02:02:05 [INFO] [PermissionsCompat] Parsing "nether.yml" file
    2011-08-30 02:02:05 [INFO] [PermissionsCompat] Parsing "worldeco.yml" file
    2011-08-30 02:02:05 [INFO] Permission backend changed!
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [INFO] [PermissionsEx] Initializing file backend
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [INFO] Error: null
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE] Error: null
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE] java.util.ConcurrentModificationException
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at java.util.HashMap$HashIterator.nextEntry(Unknown Source)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at java.util.HashMap$ Source)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.compat.P2Entity.getAllOptions(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.ProxyPermissionUser.getAllOptions(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.backends.FileBackend.dumpData(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.bukkit.commands.UtilityCommands.dumpData(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at sun.reflect.NativeMethodAccessorImpl.invoke0(Native Method)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at sun.reflect.NativeMethodAccessorImpl.invoke(Unknown Source)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at sun.reflect.DelegatingMethodAccessorImpl.invoke(Unknown Source)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at java.lang.reflect.Method.invoke(Unknown Source)
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.commands.CommandsManager$
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.commands.CommandsManager.execute(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at ru.tehkode.permissions.bukkit.PermissionsEx.onCommand(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at org.bukkit.command.PluginCommand.execute(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at org.bukkit.command.SimpleCommandMap.dispatch(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at org.bukkit.craftbukkit.CraftServer.dispatchCommand(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at net.minecraft.server.MinecraftServer.b(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at net.minecraft.server.MinecraftServer.h(
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at
    2011-08-30 02:02:15 [SEVERE]    at
    Using 1060
  15. Offline


    Conversion to bPermissions will work ;)
  16. That just means something is wrong with the files you put in to be converted.
  17. Offline


    So any ETA on permissions 4?
  18. U serious?
  19. Offline


    I was eager to see how the complete rewrite was going to turn out. Can I see as far as you got?
  20. We canceled the project with the advice of EvilSteph.
  21. Offline


    You could have just renamed it, I was really looking forward to seeing how you were managing the SuperPerms nodes.
    Mind if I see as far as you got?
  22. You'd have to ask our lead dev, he has the code. He was just about to start over from scratch though, so I doubt its worth looking at.
  23. Offline


    Well there's no reason he can't. Just don't call it Permissions
  24. PEX already has backwards compatibility for Permissions, so there is no reason at all to continue with it.
  25. Offline


    bPermissions has an import function.
    Perhaps your plugin would work better than PEX or bPermissions
  26. I went into IRC with EvilSteph and SwearWord and they convinced me this was a bad idea in the long run.

    If our lead developer wants to continue it he'd being doing it by himself, everything works fine with PEX now.
  27. Offline


    Could you let him know I'm interested to see his work? I may be able to incorporate some of it into bPermissions if it's good.
  28. Offline


    People really hated Permissions lol
  29. Offline


    I have to say i have used permisions 3 and have always found it easy to use and trouble free and today i tried switching to the new superperms and i cant get it to work at all . While i understand the need to move into the future i have to say i also think the move to take all the old files down and force people to move to a new system is very heavy handed. I personally will most likely see if i can write a converter/bridge between old and new and see how it goes.

    Having said all that i also want to say thanks to OP for a great program that did its job well and a minimum of trouble (at least for me) .
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page