Mojang and the Bukkit Project

Discussion in 'Community News and Announcements' started by vubui, Sep 5, 2014.

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    Funny how it was removed ONLY when mojang admitted to owning bukkit. Do you notice what the donations are for website hosting and resources which is all provided by curse, which curse do in return for displaying their ads on Bukkit sites.
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    I am not a lawyer. This is not legal advice.

    This entire DMCA notice hinges on one part: who owns the source code to the decompiled server .jar. Wesley claims Mojang does. If this is true, then there are some points to consider:
    1. Mojang never made the initial commit of the decompiled source code to the CraftBukkit repository
    2. The code was therefore stolen
    3. A license was applied on by someone other than the copyright owner
    4. Wesley has no claims to the decompiled code
    CraftBukkit is legally using Wesley's code, under the terms of the licensing Wesley used when submitting his patches. Wesley would have a valid point if Wesley's code was inserted into Mojang's official mine craft_server.jar. I doubt Wesley has any evidence that any of his code is in the official .jar.

    Good Guy Mojang hasn't sued the person that decompiled the .jar and then claimed copyright to the decompiled code.
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    Funny how mojang admitted to owning bukkit when EvilSeph left the project. I wouldn't leave donations to me in a project if I left it.
    jorisk322 and smbarbour like this.
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    Bukkit doesn't have NMS in it though, so even under his claim it's not violating GPL. Only CraftBukkit applies to the DMCA takedown. Don't believe me? You can still download Bukkit, won't get you far on it's own but you can. I was correct, this dispute is over CraftBukkit only, not Bukkit.
    Relicum likes this.
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    Ok explain what else he could of done, all he wants is the license's to be honored simple as. Mojang sat there for 2 years owning the community knowing the licenses were valid. Mojang are the ones to state the licenses are invalid there is no possible way for this to be resolved. Mojang can't agree to validate the licenses as that has potential to release more private code under their IPR, than they are happy with which is perfectly understandable. This happens time and time again with Open Source Projects and commercial companies don't understand each others actions and a lot of the time their is to many conflicts.(Yes some do work most don't) Open Source has a set of values its not just the license. Unless you have been involved its hard to understand.

    It seem like you feel he "owes" you something and by him just claiming what is rightfully his, has effected you ability to play minecraft. Minecraft can be downloaded from the minecraft site. That is what people paid for NOT bukkit.

    But am happy to hear how you think it should of been handled

    Fair enough my point was he had contributed a large amount of code.

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 14, 2016
    hintss likes this.
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    lol wrong click a link in their and you will get a 404 error...
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    Just you man.
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    No. Bukkit is licensed under the GPL. CraftBukkit includes Bukkit code, but violates Bukkit's license because it includes NMS, whose source code it does not provide under the GPL.
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    Yes. That doesn't contradict what I said.
  10. First the EULA, then Bukkit, now DMCA'd. It stinks.
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    It is good to see a statement from Mojang. Nothing about the statement is really that surprising. They weren't prepared for the collapse of the Bukkit project, because they weren't really involved in it.

    There have been some terrible PR mis-steps, that have led to wild speculation, and it's rending the community apart. I doubt, for example, that Wolvereness would have filed the DMCA complaint, if not for some of the things communicated unofficially by Mojang. (Sorry, Dinnerbone, your tweet was probably the spark).

    I think the major factor in play right now is the fact that the Bukkit project has never formally been granted permission to decompile the minecraft server, and then repackage it with their API, in CraftBukkit. I suspect that the grounds on which the DMCA complaint were filed are based on the fact that Bukkit (GPL) is combined with CraftBukkit (non GPL, Mojang EULA), which are incompatible. If Mojang truly OWNS Bukkit, then it has been violating the GPL ever since it's acquisition. If, on the other hand, Bukkit was never authorized to bundle NMS with CraftBukkit, then the Bukkit team has violated the EULA.

    Ah, what a twisted web we weave.... If I interpret what I've read correctly, the new EULA is what sparked concern from the core Bukkit team about continuing development. They became intensely aware of the grey area that they were working in. Uncomfortable with continuing, they terminated the project. Then, Mojang sweeps in and says, No! Bukkit is ours, we will continue to release it... Just like that, the legal concerns that caused the core Bukkit team to decide to cancel the project are resolved, because Mojang isn't going to litigate against itself.

    Now, Mojang has to figure out a way through this, that doesn't risk their proprietary software, but keeps Bukkit alive...

    The plot thickens...

    Inscrutable and sorklin like this.
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    To keep it simple ; Bukkit is dead or not ? And for Bukkit in 1.8 ? ....

  13. 16,591,904 people have bought the game.
    In the last 24 hours, 9,077 people bought the game.

    So far today you have made $236,002.
    For that salary you can afford a full time developer for the Bukkit project.
    Nick Foster and Inscrutable like this.
  14. The slight oddity just on reading: unknwoingly contributing to a project vs. contributing not knowing it's owned by someone. If it was owned by Curse, likely nothing would have changed as opposed to ownership by Mojang, even with the MC plugin API released - the worst dreams would have been Mojang somehow trying to kill the mods, e.g. with license claims.
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    So does Mojang have no responsibility to remove the DCMA takedown notice? If not, who does? This prevents people from downloading newer versions of Bukkit. I just want to download certain versions of Bukkit.
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    If you read my suggestion, you would have seen this: which discusses how to properly craft a specific exception to allow non-GPL code to interface with GPL code.
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    there have been no newer version here
  18. Two problems:
    - You had different pricing since alpha releases.
    - Lots of expenses (e.g. session and auth servers for 16000000 players).
    - One developer doesn't do it all - another reasoning also was that such interference couldve been worse for the project. Now if if Bukkit really "wanted" support, why not ask for it and/or work towards it with public support of the community? Pretty odd if you as me, as if they had the esteem to "be Minecraft instead of Mojang". But probably they'll have to think about new ways, remains the problem, that the lawyers have to solve first. Could be there is no more CraftBukkit.

    Maybe you're still right though :).
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    Is Wesley EvilSeph?
    squidicuz and drtshock like this.
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    I am a little bit tired of all this drama. Like are we fucking 3rd graders?

    EDIT: Not actually have sexual intercourse with 3rd graders, but we are acting like third graders was the point I was trying to make.
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    No. Wesley is Wesley Wolfe. Wolvereness
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    I didn't say that; you missed my point.
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    Recently no. Other versions are not accessible at the moment though.
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    Are we all reading the same post? Some folks seem to be completely missing a few things...

    They are not saying that they give permissions for decompiled/modified minecraft_server (mc_dev) to distributed under the LGPL or GPL, they are just saying that they are not the ones asking for it to be taken down. Choosing not to enforce your IP rights in a specific situation is LEAGALLY very different then granting rights. The take down is 100% on Wesley's shoulders as he is the one issuing the ultimatum that either minecraft_server is (L)GPL or CraftBukkit is dead. (Like it or not, a project that has a broken license can survive for years if the IP owners involved choose NOT to kill it off. Is the community really better served by killing CraftBukkit?.)

    On a side topic, my understanding is that the Bukkit donation page was by/for EvilSeth, so it makes perfect sense that it was taken down when he decided to walk away from the project. That does not seem to have anything to do with Mojang.

    My takeaway is that anyone who has any understanding of what Bukkit/CraftBukkit is understands, it has always been a project that existed solely because Mojang chose to ignore the fact that it was distributing their IP without a valid license. It could live on in the same manner if contributors like Wesley were willing to continue to ignore the broken license.

    Please do not continue insult everyone's intelligence and try to claim that anyone involved every thought the project met the requirements of the GPL. CraftBukket has been distributed without a valid license since day one, and until Wesley chose to blow the whistle, it never prevented it from being a successful project.

    (Sorry for all the edits... typos and bad wording, no real content changes.)
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    MBon29 the DMCA affects all version since the commit mentionned in the DMCA... which was done in 2012
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    This is bullcrap come on realize that without bukkit mine craft wouldn't have been successful
    Europia79 likes this.
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    I am well aware of that and agree with you but that requires Mojang to do. Like you I am not expecting them to open source minecraft itself. Even now the OP is vague as to that they actually want, and has a bullish tone to it. The lack of a clear statement of what is valid and what isn't. As that's my main issue is their attitude, to it all, yes they have to protect their assist's but random tweets and blog posts is not the way to go about it.
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    Having the money helps but does not make it the right choice. 9 women working together cannot make a baby in 1 month.

    Dinnerbone has made it clear that there is no way Bukkit can be converted into a viable/manageable API with the capabilities they want to provide. The way it hooks into Minecraft will just not allow it. If the original author feels this way, why does everyone think they know more than he does? (I certainly do not know the answer and have to take his word for it.)

    You are also missing the fact that CraftBukkit does not and will never actually meet the terms of the license that it is distributed under.

    Bukkit exists today only because the owners of the related IP (Mojang and those who have contributed code) have in the past been willing the fact that the license is broken. Mojang as made it clear that they are willing to continuing turning a blind eye and let it live.

    Let me state that IANAL, but even my untrained eye can see at least 3 thing that prevent it from ever having being distributed under a valid license. It can only continue to exist if the IP owners (the only ones with a legal right to complain) go back to ignoring the legal distribution issues. (Remember, that ignoring the problem does not grant any rights, but as the last 3 years have proven it can easily allow the project live on.)
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    As a plugin developer, just want to say that if bukkit goes down I will not be writing plugins for forge or other third-party APIs.

    The official minecraft plugin API will be my only avenue for making plugins if there is no bukkit.

    Also, I think @Wolvereness had every right to make his claim and bukkit should be stripped of his contributions as he does not want them in there. This reddit post was very clear and helped me understand the situation:

    I just hope that this situation accelerates the production of the official plugin api.
    krisdestruction likes this.
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    I feel stupid now that I actually read the thread.
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