Bukkit ShutDown - Development

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by xYourFreindx, Aug 21, 2014.

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  1. Jozeth and joshwenke like this.
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    What exactly is the point of the thread?
  3. Maulss So I can easily link people to all related twitter feeds regarding the bukkit shutdown.
    In other words... For lazy people who can't be bothered to look all the links up on twitter.
    hintss likes this.
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    Ah, okay. Most of them are on the twitter feed on the front page though, anyway.
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    Mojangs acquisition of Bukkit was announced publicly in February 2012 so I'm not sure what md_5 is talking about or why he would want to fight Mojang preventing bukkits death.
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    I can actually understand the confusion about the fact, that Mojang owns Bukkit.
    It hasn't been explicite stated, that Bukkit is owned by Mojang before today, but as Mojang never used this, until now (to rescue the project), I think there is no reason to be overly worried about that fact.

    I still see no signs that Mojang is in any way evil.
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    No it wasn't.
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    Nothing is now going to happen for the next 6 hours.
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    They might not have come out and said plainly that "Mojang now owns the entirety of Bukkits team and code" (although at least one news article reported that and it's certainly possible I've missed an official post mentioning it) but at the time of the hiring a lot of people were worried that Mojang was actually going to shut Bukkit down. It was made clear by Dinnerbone and EvilSeph that the Mojang Employed Bukkit team was still in charge of Bukkit and that they would only shut Bukkit down after the official API was ready to replace it.

    The thing is, back in 2012 those 4 developers essentially were Bukkit. Nobody expected Bukkit to be needed for another 2 years. Nobody expected EvilSeph to leave Mojang or for so many other non-Mojang employees to join the Bukkit team. At the time, telling us they had hired the Bukkit team was the same thing as saying they owned Bukkit. Not to mention the fact Dinnerbone and grum were still listed as part of the Bukkit team this whole time which is why they were able to so quickly take over the project. They never left it and had the right to continue working on it regardless of legal ownership.

    I still don't see why anyone would be against this. The alternative is the complete and total death of Bukkit. And what exactly would Bukkit gain from not being owned by Mojang? They let Bukkit operate normally until they had to step in to save the entire project. Even then, it's actual members of Bukkit team that stepped in. Even if Bukkit wasn't owned by Mojang, EvilSeph should have talked to Dinnerbone before cancelling the entire bukkit project. The news post claims that this decision wasn't easy and that EvilSeph really truly wanted to let other people else take over Bukkit but he didn't even try to do the one completely obvious thing that could keep Bukkit going.
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    Mojang is going to ruin bukkit with all these rules now, watch.
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    What rules? If you mean the ban on pay-to-win servers, there is literally nothing they could do to enforce that in Bukkits code. They've owned Bukkit this entire time, if they were going to enforce rules on it they would have done it long ago. This is exactly the kind of doom and gloom crap that people posted back in 2012 and nothing came of it then either.
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    Wait does this mean that all the Bukkit staff (Such as yourself) weren't aware that they were working for Mojang? Seriously? All respect for Mojang lost.
    hintss likes this.
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    You said "Mojangs acquisition of Bukkit was announced publicly in February 2012". That's not true, it was never announced publicly until on Twitter today.
  14. I thought I had remembered something being mentioned in some video with the Bukkit staff. Minecon 2012 perhaps?

    Yep, here's a video: EvilSeth said himself that they'd been working with Mojang since February 28th 2012. Not sure if Mojang officially owned Bukkit at that time though...
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    That's true, but it wasn't RiotShielder who said that quote, it was KaBob.
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    Working for a company and having a project acquired by that company are completely different.
    hintss likes this.
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  18. So I guess Bukkit was working with Mojang in February of 2012, and officially joined Bukkit in June of 2012. That's the forum post I was trying to look for btw. Couldn't find it though xD
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    For the third time, that post does not say that Mojang acquired Bukkit.

    hintss likes this.
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    chaseoes Yeah, I guess you are right.
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    As I have debated in another thread, Mojang's claims to "own" Bukkit are vastly overstated. Since they have never legally acquired copyright to every single piece of the contributed code over the years, their "ownership" is limited. Nobody, even the original Bukkit developers had legal rights to transfer ownership of code contributed by others, without first obtaining permission from the creators of that piece of code, unless that author legally transferred those rights. Some have argued that this transfer of ownership was "implied", but I doubt that would hold up if tested in a court of law.

    Now, they could very well have purchased things such as the Bukkit name, domain name, servers, possibly even the code behind some of the servers. But they never sought consent to acquire certain original works, including any commit not made by Mojang staff, contributions to the wiki, etc.

    This grey area of Mojang's belief that they "own" Bukkit, and the community's belief that it belongs to the "public domain" will likely be a dinnerbone of contention for a while to come. By asserting that the community that has been maintaining Bukkit had no right to announce that it was no longer going to be maintained, they erred in their public management of the issue. That announcement has alienated a number of people, me included, who see it as a slight against those who have kept it alive for so long. All they needed to do was say: "Mojang is committing to a Bukkit release for 1.8! We thank EvilSeph and the Bukkit team for their contributions and hope to work with them in the future". Then, they could have sorted things out with the Core Bukkit team in the background. Instead, they came out heavy-handed in a public forum, insulted a bunch of people in the community and told them that their reality was wrong, and Mojang was all-powerful.

    If I were Mojang, I'd probably hire someone to manage PR. This is not the first time that they have alienated a large group of their community by pulling out the BigHammer(tm). With a slightly different approach, they could have made the EULA changes and this Bukkit transition a non-issue, kept the community calm, and retained more of the developer community that helps drive new player revenue.

    I'm sure there are a lot of people tired of hearing my opinions on this. I've just discovered that I am too, so I'm going to fade back into the background now, grab some popcorn, and see what happens.

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    I must say that this is simply beautiful! Kind sir, you have made my day!
    But... Back to reality!
    I can pretty much agree with everything that was summed up but I yet can't believe about everything thing that has happened in Mojang. It's all just unbelievable...
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    Due to its licensing, the Bukkit/CraftBukkit source belongs to the public. Anyone is free to modify, use, and distribute it as they see fit (within the bounds of the license and the law). Redistributing it will require publishing the source, notice of any code changes, and retention of license.

    However, Bukkit brand and assets (name, site, code repository, CI, etc) belong to Mojang. They would not be able to change the software licensing without obtaining permission from contributors, or removing their code. Also, since Mojang owns Bukkit and has been distributing software that is an extension of the Minecraft server under LGPL, it is not bound by other restrictions like Minecraft's end user license agreement.

    EvilSeph cited the EULA and lack of support from Mojang as the two major reasons for the shutdown. This is my personal opinion, but the community pretty much got a best case scenario from all this: no EULA restrictions, and direct support from Mojang.
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    Are they going to continue development of Bukkit until the elusive Minecraft API comes out?
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    I'm pretty sure that Bukkit will keep going till a official API is released! But till then, Bukkit will remain number 1! :)
    Acer_Mortem and Jozeth like this.
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    May or may not be off topic but, I think this is the answer to bukkit shutdown.[cake] Haven't posted on the forums in a long time.[​IMG]
    unon1100, KingFaris11, hintss and 2 others like this.
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    Amazing. :D
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